I HATE EVs because...

[calvinhobbes]

I don’t need to be taught how to refuel a gasoline or diesel car. I also don’t need special apps or fuel cards just to switch on the “fuel” nozzle. That’s the point I’m trying to make.

I’d like an electric car, but if this I the life I have to live, fuck that.

I agree with that apart from the part about learning how to refuel any car. You did have to figure that out at some point and it can be annoying when e.g. you're at one of those self-service pumps in the US that don't accept foreign credit cards.

My experience is that the prices the various companies charge you per kWh can vary to an absurd degree. So finding the cheapest option for any given charge point can be an involuntary treasure hunt, which it shouldn't be. But on the upside, some of them do take their sweet time until they actually take the money out of your account: Shell has only just (6 March) debited my card for a charging session on 25 January.

 

[93Flareside]

Took you assholes long enough to put two and two together.

 

[DanRoM]

My experience is that the prices the various companies charge you per kWh can vary to an absurd degree.

I see you have already forgotten the equally infuriating price changes for petrol throughout the day that we have in Germany.

 

[calvinhobbes]

I see you have already forgotten the equally infuriating price changes for petrol throughout the day that we have in Germany.

I didn’t mention those because I haven’t seen differences greater than 100% for fuels. With angry pixies, that’s a sad reality.

 

[calvinhobbes]

Took you assholes long enough to put two and two together.

I’d rather get something done while my rented EV is charging. Shopping, eating, sightseeing… been there, done that and all were better than standing around at a service station for twenty minutes, which I’ve also done.

By the way, that ARAL is five minutes from my home.

 

[eizbaer]

Took you assholes long enough to put two and two together.

Well, ackshully, Aral / Bp Pulse are one of the larger high power charging operators in Germany… not quite Tesla or EnBW, but last numbers I remember had them at about 1/3 of their chargers. That actually quite respectable, and while it did take them way too long to see/accept the signs, at least their rollout is progressing quite quickly.

 

[calvinhobbes]

I didn’t mention those because I haven’t seen differences greater than 100% for fuels. With angry pixies, that’s a sad reality.

to use my nearest charging point as an example:

Chargemap: 0,359/kWh, no info on "blocking fees"
ChargePoint: 0,69/kWh + 5,71/hour after the first two hours
EnBW mobility+: not available
EWE Go: not available
Shell Recharge: 0,59/kWh + 0,10/min after the first four hours, up to 12,- per session
UNIEQ Power: 0,52/kWh + 0,05/min after the first four hours, between 06:00 and 17:59

And those are just the apps I have on my phone. This market is currently the Wild West and screaming for regulation as well as harmonisation.

 

[eizbaer]

This market is currently the Wild West and screaming for regulation as well as harmonisation

Haha, cute I was doing EV roaming crap in 2015 - that was Wild West back then. The situation now is actually much better… which doesn’t mean the whole industry needs to be hit with the regulatory hammer. Hard. Yes. Right in the kisser.

.. who runs your closest charger? I have certain suspicions, looking at those prices and the fact that it’s unavailable on Germany’s largest EMP (enbw) - the latter is a rather big exception, to be fair.

 

[calvinhobbes]

Haha, cute I was doing EV roaming crap in 2015 - that was Wild West back then.

I think I was still fantasising about FCEVs being the future back then.

.. who runs your closest charger?

Stadtwerke Hürth AFAIK and they required the "UNIEQ Power App" when I first used this charger. That in turn seems to be based on a backend offered by Chargecloud. They haven't really caught on to the whole "cut out the middle man" thing, apparently.

 

[eizbaer]

They haven't really caught on to the whole "cut out the middle man" thing, apparently.

Nearly nobody has, tbh… it’s so nice of you can just buy all the processing from a third party and not actually think about what’s happening.

well, at least I was close enough with my suspicions, another large chargecloud customer that whole network used to be very anti-roaming for a long while…

 

[jack_christie]

Terror on M62 as police cars swarm carriageway to save driver after electric car can't brake​

Terror on M62 as police save driver after car stops being able to brake

Police raced to the scene after an electric car suffered a dangerous fault while driving along the busy motorway

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

 

[eizbaer]

… whiiiich has exactly nothing to do with this being an EV.

 

[NooDle]

to use my nearest charging point as an example:

Chargemap: 0,359/kWh, no info on "blocking fees"
ChargePoint: 0,69/kWh + 5,71/hour after the first two hours
EnBW mobility+: not available
EWE Go: not available
Shell Recharge: 0,59/kWh + 0,10/min after the first four hours, up to 12,- per session
UNIEQ Power: 0,52/kWh + 0,05/min after the first four hours, between 06:00 and 17:59

And those are just the apps I have on my phone. This market is currently the Wild West and screaming for regulation as well as harmonisation.

While this is true (and super annoying), fast charging isn't really the way you should be charging regularly anyways.

From what I gather slow charging (public) is significantly cheaper and also more consistent, which makes sense as you'll be parked overnight.
Also, no blocking fees mostly (because who wants to get up at 4 am to unplug and move their car)

Home charging is cheaper still, but yes, I know, not everyone has a driveway, cable doesn't reach far enough, etc...

 

[NooDle]

Terror on M62 as police save driver after car stops being able to brake

Police raced to the scene after an electric car suffered a dangerous fault while driving along the busy motorway

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

View attachment 3572038

I love the drama British newspapers come up with. "the terrifying incident occured"...
No, not really. Car was without brakes, cop cars surrounded it, and gently stopped, bumping into it. Nobody was hurt. The end.
Also, this could have been an ICE car but then again that wouldn't be such a good headline

 

[calvinhobbes]

While this is true (and super annoying), fast charging isn't really the way you should be charging regularly anyways.

The charger in question is a 22kW one. Does that count as fast charging? There’s also a set of 150kW and 300kW chargers nearby, but I didn’t fancy looking those fees up as well.

Anyway, I rent what I drive and I live in an apartment building with no charging infrastructure, so I have to use what’s available within walking distance of my home. Not a problem, but it does mean that I want fast charging speeds and don’t need to worry about keeping the battery in shape.

 

[eizbaer]

Also, no blocking fees mostly (because who wants to get up at 4 am to unplug and move their car)

that's the thing though, with the clusterfuck that is the german EV infrastructure market (1400 registered operators, 1250 registered billing providers), that very much is a reality. even the biggest provider (enbw) does have a blocking fee that goes into effect after 4 hours AC side. and there is no "except at night" either - which, at least, the utility I work for does have.

 

[NooDle]

The charger in question is a 22kW one. Does that count as fast charging? There’s also a set of 150kW and 300kW chargers nearby, but I didn’t fancy looking those fees up as well.

Anyway, I rent what I drive and I live in an apartment building with no charging infrastructure, so I have to use what’s available within walking distance of my home. Not a problem, but it does mean that I want fast charging speeds and don’t need to worry about keeping the battery in shape.

22 kw is generally considered as "slow", because that usually means 11 kw (since most cars can only take so much).
In your case I would look for the fastest charger around and charge there/stay there for 30 minutes or so to get the battery near full.
150+ kw charging is usually more expensive, but you pay for not having the hassle with AC chargers and BYOC (bring your own cable).

Yes it's a hassle, but given your situation the quickest/easiest way to do it.

 

[calvinhobbes]

In your case I would look for the fastest charger around and charge there/stay there for 30 minutes or so to get the battery near full.

The last time I had an EV, that's exactly what I wanted to do. But the car filled up a lot faster than expected, so I picked it up at 100%.

Yes it's a hassle, but given your situation the quickest/easiest way to do it.

I don't think it is one. I can drop the car off at the 150kW/300kW fast charger I mentioned (EnBW at the nearby hardware store), plug it in, walk home in about five minutes, do something useful and then go back to pick it up when it's charged. Sure, I could drive to a fuel station and pump some liquefied dinosaurs into it faster, but the total difference is something like ten minutes and the angry pixies can be much cheaper.

 

[jack_christie]

I love the drama British newspapers come up with. "the terrifying incident occured"...
No, not really. Car was without brakes, cop cars surrounded it, and gently stopped, bumping into it. Nobody was hurt. The end.
Also, this could have been an ICE car but then again that wouldn't be such a good headline

Only at 90mph

M62 driver speaks out following claims Jaguar suffered 'electrical fault'

Police swarmed the stretch of motorway after the car was left speeding and out of control

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

 

[NooDle]

Well that does sound more like a ‘can’t disengage cruise control’ problem rather than related to it being electric. I’m guessing even with an ICE car you can turn the ignition/engine off and just coast to a halt?